Buying a boat—or maintaining one well over time—often comes down to knowing what to pay attention to beyond the obvious.
In this episode, I sit down with Aaron Bandstra, a marine surveyor based in the Pacific Northwest, to talk about what surveyors are actually looking for when they inspect a boat and what buyers and owners can learn from that perspective.
A big part of our conversation is about what really tells the story of a well-cared-for boat. Aaron explains why condition often goes far beyond cosmetics, and how things like dryness, exercised through-hulls, maintenance evidence, tidy systems, and practical gear can reveal whether a boat has been actively cared for.
We also talk about common red flags buyers may overlook, including boats that have been sitting unused for long periods, inherited or neglected boats, and systems that may function today but could create challenges later.
And then there’s one of the more interesting topics: creative owner-built solutions. Many cruisers modify their boats in clever ways, but not every custom fix is easy to maintain, reliable long-term, or ideal for a future owner. Aaron explains how surveyors evaluate those systems and communicate that nuance to buyers.
Transcript
Annika: [00:00:00] Now, so you are a marine surveyor, and before we dive into all the technical things, I just wanted to talk a little bit about what drew you into this line of work. And, uh, I guess behind that, I’m also wondering how does one actually become a marine surveyor?
Aaron Bandstra: Yeah. That’s a good question. Um, well I’ve always been interested in boats.
Um, after high school I went to a boat building school, the Northwest School of Wooden Boat Building in Port Townsend, Washington, um, and got involved with, you know, with boat repair, uh, boat maintenance at that point. I did go to college. I have a BA, but always had these great summer jobs working at boatyards, uh, specifically in Port Townsend, and then later up in Alaska, uh, working mostly on commercial boats, uh, working as a shipwright, uh, and technician, uh, fixing boats, and that was exciting and a really neat, neat place to spend my summers.
And so after college, I kinda just stuck with the boat thing. I, I continued to work on boats, both [00:01:00] one more summer in Alaska and then- A little bit on the East Coast, spent a bit of time in Massachusetts, um, and then finally in Bellingham, Washington, where I live now. And so for many years, I worked in a, a big boatyard, uh, here in Bellingham, uh, first as a technician, then later as a manager, uh, working on all kinds of boat repair, maintenance, projects, um, handling everything from just annual maintenance to major upgrades, um, you know, bow thruster installations, re-rigging.
Um, sometimes we participate in, you know, repowering projects. Um, lots of repair, lots of grounding damage, um, repairs, upgrades. Uh, we’ve even done some, like, hull extensions, hull modification projects. and really all types of vessels, so primarily fiberglass for sure, but also some wooden vessels, um, some aluminum steel vessels.
a mix of pleasure craft and commercial. Mo- I would say [00:02:00] probably that boatyard was probably 75% pleasure boats and 25% commercial. Uh, both, on the commercial side it was both, um, fishing boats and also passenger carrying boats. There’s quite a, there’s an industry around here of, you know, whale watch tour type boats, and so there’s a fair number of those boats that, that come to the boatyard annually.
so yeah, and kind of toward the end of that time, um, I connected with, uh, an established, uh, marine surveyor, uh, who had been working here in town or in this area for a long time, um, very well-respected surveyor named Matt Harris, and he was looking to kind of pass on his knowledge, his business. Um, so we came to an agreement and I, I worked with him, essentially apprenticed with him, for a couple years, before he retired, and that was great.
That was a, a really nice long overlap. I was very lucky to benefit from picking up on his knowledge, his contacts, um, his approach. [00:03:00] Uh, he was known for being very thorough and very technical, um, and so I, I did my best to kind of carry that on Meanwhile, I’m- I applied into and got into our professional organization.
and once I became a certified marine surveyor, um, he, he chose to retire, and so I’ve taken over that, our business. It’s called Marine Consultants. Um, and continue to offer really the same service, which is, condition and valuation marine surveys. also do do some damage surveys. So quite often, you know, in surveying, uh, boats need to have an inspection report after an incident, whether it’s a grounding or a fire or something like that.
And so part of the job can be to, to evaluate that and, and write up a report on that
Annika: So you kind of had the boating background anyway, uh, and then that led into a more of a passion work, and through an apprentice then, running the firm. That’s, uh, that’s a really nice story.
Aaron Bandstra: [00:04:00] It, it’s true that, you know, surveyors come into it from different ways.
Um- Mm-hmm … there are some guys who maybe come out of the Navy, have that, that background. Other guys come out of more of a boat operation background. Maybe they were professional sailors or boat operators for a long time, um, and then choose to get into that, and those are all valuable experiences. Um, so I definitely come from more of the technical repair side of things, although I am myself a boater.
I lo- I’m a sailor. But I would say my primary value is coming out of the boat repair industry, um, and really knowing or being familiar with all aspects of boat repair, um, and have just been, been around a lot of big projects.
Annika: Yeah, I can imagine in that area especially, there’s so many different kind of boats, uh, not just your sailboats, but also those, whale watching boats like you mentioned.
A lot of, uh, different industry out there, in your area. Now, what does a typical survey day look like for you? If you’re going to go survey a boat, um, how does that look like?
Aaron Bandstra: Yeah. Well, [00:05:00] so I mean, really it starts before survey day, right? Somebody, is interested in a boat and, and makes a deal. So they typically will, go ahead and negotiate a price on a boat, typically contingent on survey, at which point they contact surveyors, usually a few, and kind of see who’s available, um, shop around a little bit.
And if if we come to an agreement, then I’ll schedule a survey day, and that takes some coordination. Most often it’s involving brokers. Typically, the boats I work on are being sold by a broker. Um, and, you know, the broker does most of the organizing typically, um, maybe helps suggest a few surveyors.
Um, and then once the agreement’s made, helps arrange for the, all the details. And so that can be, haul out. So typically a survey involves a haul out, um, so that needs to be arranged for. And sometimes other, other people are involved. So for example, on a sailboat you might also hire a rigger to look at the, the [00:06:00] rigging.
Um, a rigger would go aloft and do a more, a more in-depth inspection of the sailboat rigging. And often too, y- diesel mechanic is hired to inspect, to do a deep inspection of the engine, take oil samples. So all that requires quite a bit of coordination. So typically the broker’s involved with, with getting all those pieces lined up.
Um, and then on survey day, you generally, it’s, you know, arrive at the marina at the boat slip, um, and spend some time, you know, doing some initial inspections, um, document the boat. So I always start with a bunch of pictures inside and out.
And then, usually start by looking at the, the state of charge of the, the battery systems to see how, how that’s going. Um, typically, hopefully the boat’s been plugged into shore power, and so it’s in a stable place where I can see that the battery banks are at a normal float voltage. They’re not being undercharged or overcharged.
Then I’ll look at the propulsion, so look at the engine. Of course, check fluids, make sure the [00:07:00] boat’s safe to run, um, and make sure the seacocks open, et cetera. Uh, do a kind of initial kind of overall look at the, the engine and, uh, drivetrain, packing gland. Um, and then typically motor over to the haulout.
Um, so generally, like, there’s, you know, there’s boatyards scattered around, so typically this is, like, nearby the marina. Um, and haul the boat out for about one hour. And so generally for a survey haulout, they– so boatyard’s often called a one-way haulout, which is out of the water, uh, it can get pressure washed if needed.
Um, that’s important because the boat needs to be pretty clean to, to give it a good thorough inspection. Um, then I need some t- you know, maybe 30 to 60 minutes to inspect. Um, and that inspection is, you know, first looking at the hull, um, visual inspections, looking for blisters, looking coatings issues.
Um, and then I always, um, hammer tap the hull. This is, [00:08:00] you know, old style surveying, right? With a small ball-peen hammer and, you know, really listening for any kind of issues with the fiberglass. So listening for delamination, listening and looking for past repairs. Um, if it’s a cored hull, I’m looking, trying to sense, uh, the condition of that core.
I’ll take moisture readings as well. That can be another tool to, to better, better understand the condition of that hull. Um, and then looking at propulsion, so looking at the propeller, cutless bearing condition, shaft, Rudder. So grab the rudder, shake it, see how the linkage feels, uh, try to get a sense of how the bearings are, are doing.
And then if the boat has a, a bonding system, so often the through-hull fittings and underwater metals are connected to a common anode, uh, with a network of wires. And so I’ll, I’ll test the integrity of that. So I use my ohm meter, a, a multimeter with a, a resistance, uh, function to, [00:09:00] and a long wire to check resistance between that, that anode and all those fittings, and note, you know, where things are at.
And the standard does call for less than one ohm resistance. So anything over one ohm, I’ll note, and often it’s a corroded wire terminal or something like that, that, you know, later could be addressed. Um, so do that. Um, and then top side, so above the waterline, I’ll get up on a ladder, visually inspect, um, also hammer tap with a, a soft plastic hammer looking for the same things, any kind of delamination issues.
and then after all that’s done, have a conversation with the prospective buyer usually, um, look things over, um, and go back in the water. And that’s generally followed by a sea trial. Um, so although we– in the industry, we call it a trial run, not a sea trial. Those are two different things. And so trial run is a, a limited inspection of certain things, and so looking at engine performance, um, [00:10:00] making power up all the navigation electronics, make sure they’re looking normal or working normally, um, confirm the autopilot is tracking, often run the engine up through a range of RPMs and record data.
Um, so make sure that the engine’s cooling system can keep up, um, making sure the gauges are working normally, uh, looking at the exhaust. so and if it’s a sailboat, typically go for a sail. So, uh, you know, while, you know, the s-sail inspection is not really part of the survey, I try to do my best to kind of help give a general assessment of how things stand.
Uh, make sure the rigging functions normally. Um, you know, we sail around for a little bit, maybe tack a couple of times, uh, make sure that, you know, the sail is hoist normally, the halyards are in good shape, the sheaves are turning, the furler furls and unfurls normally. Um, yeah. And, oh, winches, of course.
Make sure the winches are turning normally. Um, so yeah, kind of run through [00:11:00] really kind of a basic, sailing scenario After that, um, head back, gen- generally head back to the dock. It’s often time, oftentimes though that is a time for the prospective buyer to maybe take the wheel. Uh, it’s typically the first time they’ve sailed the boat, um, so it’s a chance for them to get a sense of things, feel it, um, feel the helm.
Um, and after, you know, sailing around for a little bit, we generally, um, head back to the boat slip in the marina, um, and finish up the survey. So often this lasts until, you know, late afternoon. So a typical, let’s say a 40-foot sailboat will easily be an eight-hour day between the initial inspection, the haul out, sailing, um, and back.
So yeah. And then typically, you know, wrapping up back at the, at the marina, um, really going through the boat, you know, kind of inch by inch, and so testing everything. So testing, um, the plumbing systems, make sure the head system is [00:12:00] functioning, it’s compliant. Um, electrical systems, appliances. Uh, often there’s a propane, uh, propane galley stove to test, and so doing that, including a leak test on the propane system.
uh, looking in the bilges, testing bilge pumps, uh, looking at the keel bolts, um, mast step, bulkheads Engine exhaust system, steering systems, I’ll always try to crawl back and, and visually inspect all components of the steering. Um, so make sure all the, the steering shivs are turning, uh, make sure the quadrant is well attached to the rudder shaft, assess the the steering cable condition, rudder packing gland.
Uh, so really kind of doing a, kind of a deep dive through the whole boat. Um, and then up on deck, usually I finish up by getting up on deck, and so we’re testing navigation lights, testing the windlass, looking at the deck itself. So generally, sailboat decks are cored, um, so trying to get an assessment of the [00:13:00] condition of that.
So tap– again, hammer tapping, get the moisture meter out, looking for any moisture ingress. Um, and, uh, really trying to get a sense of the overall condition of the boat is what it’s all about. And then generally at the end of the survey, um, sit down and have a conversation. There’s often, like, a lot of things we’ve uncovered and, and so have a conversation and kind of put things in perspective and talk about some of the key findings from the day, um, some of the things that are kind of, you know, maintenance items, cosmetic.
and then after that, I, you know, work on a report. And so the report is a comprehensive summary of the, of the, of the inspection, so including inventory of the equipment and the boat, um, the, the status of all those systems, did it work or didn’t it? Um, and then a section of valuation. So my, um, my best estimate as to what the boat is worth at the time of survey based on some, some data.
So I’ll look at [00:14:00] some, uh, some comps, other similar boats. Ideally, often there’s information on what similar boats have sold for in our same area in the last, let’s say, couple of years. So take those things into account and really try to place, you know, the boat, the subject boat up against the, the range of, of comps that are available and say and think through, is this, this boat amongst its peers, is this boat average?
Is it below average? Is it above average? Um, and then taking into account, of course, equipment. Has, has there been improvements? Has it been repowered? Has it been re-rigged? Those are, those are big ones. Where is the boat being sold? Um, Seattle versus Fort Lauderdale makes a big difference. Um, and, and timing.
You know, COVID affected the market, and so there was a big bump we saw during COVID years, um, kind of coming off that now. Um, so all those things kind of factor into, to an estimate of the boat’s value. And then finally there’s a, a list of findings, and so that’s the [00:15:00] last part of the report that in detail goes through all the, all the issues we found during the survey.
Annika: Yeah, that sounds incredibly detailed. There’s a lot of inspecting and scrutinizing and even listening, as you said, uh, which is really fascinating. And I didn’t realize that you actually give the, um, not a cost estimate, but the value estimate even on a regular survey if it’s not like a valuation survey. So that’s, that’s interesting.
and that clearly sounds that it’s more than a day’s work if it’s, if it’s a 40-foot sail that takes about, what, eight hours, uh, all in, and then you need to do the reporting, which I assume is the next day thing. Yeah.
Aaron Bandstra: Well, uh, yeah, ideally next day. Sometimes things get backed up, so often it’s a few days, uh- Yeah to get the report issued. But yeah, you’re right. It’s, um Yeah, it, I mean, all told it’s a couple of days, right, between the- Yeah … the inspection and the report writing and so on. Yeah. And the travel, you know, as, you know, [00:16:00] not every boat’s right here locally, so you end up traveling, uh, a bit to get to the, the surveys.
So yeah, it, it’s a, it’s an endeavor for sure, couple days.
Annika: Yeah, absolutely, and, uh, a necessary one as well. And of course, you mentioned those discussions with the potential buyer, and I wanted to chat about this because I remember when I saw my first, um, survey report, and it wasn’t even for my boat, and I, uh, it was for someone else’s, and I saw it, I was like, “Oh my God, this boat is piece of crap.”
It’s got so many little things listed. And that wasn’t actually the case at all. It was not a bad boat, but I was just shocked by the level of detail on the report, and all the little things that you start looking at it like what’s, um, quote unquote “wrong with it,” uh, or needs to be addressed or fixed. And I’m wondering, how do you balance that need to be very thorough and honest about the boat’s conditions and flagging all those necessary concerns, while also keeping in mind that, [00:17:00] you know, somebody’s buying their first sailboat, maybe they’ve never done this before, and they might be just scared away by the list of items that you are giving them?
Aaron Bandstra: Well, first up, I would say it’s, it’s not that common for the kind of boats I’m surveying, so that, say that average survey, that 40-foot sailboat, um, usually people are coming out of other boats. That’s more common. Like, they’ve started out with a smaller sailboat, you know, they got involved with the sailing club, and then bought like a, maybe like a 25, 30-foot sailboat, and then eventually worked their way up to a 40-foot cruising sailboat.
That’s the more typical path. And so people already kind of have a sense of what’s normal, um, what’s, you know, what the priorities are, and, and what it is to maintain a boat. So that’s typical, not every case. But despite that, I don’t rely on that. I try to help put things in perspective. Um, I would say that perspective, a lot of it comes out [00:18:00] in the discussions.
Um, you know, obviously if you have a major issue that, that’s the big, you know, that, that needs to be addressed right away. Um, but then of course there’s a much longer list of, of maintenance items. Um, but then a big part of it too is, is standards, you know. So there are standards that we follow, And those standards, for the most part, there’s, there’s a range of standards.
And so there is the US Coast Guard requirements, right? There are certain things we must have, minimum number of fire extinguishers, the right placards, a horn, a functioning horn. So kind of the basics. And really a lot of times those essentials can be covered by like a, you know, a trip to the marine store to, to buy those new flares and so on.
Um, often pretty easily solved. And then there’s a, a longer list of voluntary standards, and so that would be, the ABYC standards. And the ABYC standards are, it’s a marine industry consensus. It’s a list of standards that we agree are the best practice for boat building, boat [00:19:00] maintenance.
Um, and it’s everything from, you know, how a propane system is installed, how wiring is set up, um, really the whole range. And, and those standards, you know, especially on an older boat, that boat may not have been built to those standards. And so it’s my job or any surveyor’s job to really try to to point out that, while, this may not meet, um- You know, meet today’s standard.
It’s still, it’s still, it’s still an important standard to meet. Like, so for– I, I think an- like an example of that would be, uh, you know, propane safety, right? I think we can all agree that we, we should have a system that is safe and functional. Um, and so even though that boat may not have been built when those same standards were in place, I would still inspect to our contemporary ABYC, uh, propane standards to make sure that the installation is safe.
Um, so yeah, it’s kind of, it’s kind of a balance, right? It’s a balance between, yeah, not, [00:20:00] not alarming the client, not alarming the prospective buyer, but also making them aware of, you know, these are the, the key important ones. Um, and then here’s maybe more of the best practice, uh, that maybe those are kind of a tier two, not addressed immediately, but it’d be- it would be best to bring the boat up to the modern standards in these ways.
So I– And then of course, there’s al- you know, if you’re buying a boat, you’re– especially a higher-end boat, you’re also concerned about cosmetics and making sure that everything is tip-top. So that gets on the report. But then again, that’s maybe a third category of, you know, maintenance, cosmetic issues, um, to acknowledge that, “Hey, this boat’s not perfect, but, uh, it’s still, you know, functional and best to, to bring it back up to, to top, condition.”
yeah, I think that– And then the– in the report, there’s– I usually include, um, you know, three different categories of, uh, findings. And so [00:21:00] that, that first category would be the really important stuff that– the stuff that really should be addressed, uh, before the boat gets used. And then a second longer category of, functionality issues.
Uh, if, you know, for example, something non-essential doesn’t work, um, or it’s partially functional, that ends up on that list. And then a list of those findings to say, “Hey, look, this boat doesn’t meet the contemporary standards
Annika: yeah, and I imagine your background specifically in boat building and repair is very useful for this because I would imagine, not that you can give, um, a cost estimate on how much it will cost to fix it, but you have an idea of what it takes to fix a certain type of a problem that you see.
Aaron Bandstra: That’s true. And it- you’re right, I can’t give cost estimates. Um, that’s not something a surveyor really can do, uh, you know, ’cause we’re not, we don’t represent any particular repair person or vendor, right? So, but yeah, having been in the boat repair industry, [00:22:00] you know, it’s true that I do have a sense of what it would take to bring this boat back.
Annika: Yeah, that’s, uh, always helpful information for someone who’s, uh, looking to buy a boat that maybe needs, uh, a little something fixed up as well. Now, obviously you go through the report, uh, with the prospective buyer, and they are there for the sea trial. Um, is the buyer typically there for the survey, or is that more of a hindrance for your job?
Aaron Bandstra: No, actually, I definitely prefer the buyer to be there. It’s a chance for them to really do that same deep dive through the boat. And so they come away with, you know, a much better, um, understanding of the boat, where things are. I mean, even down to, like, where is, you know, where’s the switch to turn on the, the, you know, whatever the appliance or something.
Uh, that’s helpful, and we’ll, we’ll, we gotta figure it out. So during the course of the survey, we’re looking through the whole boat and, uh, making sure that, you know, we’ve tested everything. And so that’s a chance to really get to know the boat. [00:23:00] Um, and then also to put eyes on any of the things we uncover.
So while the report is thorough and comprehensive, that’s not, that’s not the same as, you know, kneeling down and looking at that keel bolt with me with a flashlight and a mirror and, you know, maybe a camera scope. So I think I definitely encourage buyers to be present for the survey. A lot of times buyers will start by saying like, “Hey, you know, I’m not here to be in your way.
Um, you know, let me know.” And I always say something like, “Well, you know, I’m here for your benefit. I’m here to inspect the boat for you, and so you should be here.” And, and, you know, to a point. I mean, of course, like, I do need some space, some working space to move around but, um, but yeah, I think it’s, it is best for that buyer to be present
Annika: Okay, that’s great to know. And, uh, yeah, it would definitely be a useful experience to be there also learning about the boat, with you, there. Now, what can the– is it the buyer or is it the seller then to help prepare the [00:24:00] boat so that it’s easy for you to inspect, aside obviously from hauling out, but, uh, what else would be helpful for you, uh, in your line of work when you’re coming to the site?
Aaron Bandstra: Yeah. And it’s true that I probably could be a bit more explicit with this. So ideally a boat is, is ready for survey. And so what that would mean is, you know, there’s water in the tanks, of course, there’s fuel in the tanks. Um, the boat is not winterized. Uh, winterization can be, some way of preparing usually the fresh water systems, especially for, for winter.
And so people will, you know, drain systems and or add, uh, RV antifreeze, which is great. However, it makes testing difficult. So, uh, ideally it’s not winterized, um, and it’s, it’s free of clutter. So it’s normal to have a certain amount of gear on a boat, of course. There’s often, you know, filters and extra oils and safety equipment and all that is normal.
But it can be [00:25:00] challenging if the boat is, you know, if somebody just kind of steps off the boat and has all of their stuff on board, that makes surveying challenging. It’s hard to be, you know– of course, the job is to be thorough, and so no matter what, you’re still, like, moving all that stuff to get at that hatch or that switch or whatever it may be.
Um, but so I would say that’s the big one, is to kind of, uh, make sure that we, you know, we’re full of water and fuel. Um, the boat’s plugged into shore power, uh, and it’s, it’s free of extraneous gear. Um, so yeah, those things. And usually that falls– typically the broker is representing the seller and knows this.
And so, um, will have already kind of prepped the boat in that way and maybe suggested to the seller that, “Hey, let’s remove this extra stuff and get the boat kind of cleaned up and looking presentable, um, and ready to go.”
Annika: Yeah. So obviously things like needing to top up the water tanks or [00:26:00] go to get fuel before a sea trial, um, would be, um, something that slows down the process, and I can imagine, uh, it’s, it’s rather annoying or having your cushions or sail bags all over when they could be, out of the boat.
You must rely on lots of tools in order to assess the boat’s conditions all over. Um, what are some of those, tools? You mentioned the, a hammer of some sort.
Aaron Bandstra: Yeah, I mentioned– Yeah, that’s the most basic surveyor tool, the, yeah, the ball-peen hammer. Um, couple different hammers.
Uh, a steel hammer for, you know, bottom paint or for, uh, the hull bottom, and then a, a softer plastic hammer for top sides. I think I mentioned a moisture meter. Um, so I use a, a radio frequency meter, um, that measures moisture content below surface. Um, and so it’s a higher quality tool that helps assess any kind of moisture ingress, uh, decks, bulkheads, uh, cored hull, rudders.
Um, I, I also carry a, [00:27:00] um, couple different or a few different electrical testing tools. Um, one is just a basic household type outlet tester where I’m checking, you know, all the outlets on the boat for correct polarity and grounding. Um, also GFCI function. So that’s a, that’s a standard where we rec- just like in your house recommend GFCI protection, uh, in heads and galley and engine space.
, Carry a Fluke multimeter. Um, so with that, I’m test- I’m using that as a continuity tester for the bonding system. Uh, usually checking or comparing the actual battery voltage to whatever display is on board for, for checking for battery voltage level. I’m using– It has an amp clamp, so I’m using that amp clamp to check for any leakage in the, the shore power system.
Um- Let’s see. Sometimes I’ll use it for a bit of diagnostics. Um, don’t get too deep into that usually on a survey, but if something’s not working, I’ll try to be helpful and figure out, you know, why [00:28:00] is the windlass not getting power, and sometimes get the meter out to try to help sort that out, um Uh, I carry a camera scope, so, uh, or a boroscope.
So sometimes it’s helpful to look, you know, in some inaccessible place, look at those chain plates or whatever it may be. I never do I open up a tank. Um, so that’s something to know is that, you know, we’ll, we’ll try to assess condition based on what we might see, let’s say, on a fuel tank, any kind of accumulation in the Racor fuel filters.
Um, so that can be a clue as to what’s going on inside the tank, but don’t get in- into the , interiors of tanks. Um, let’s see. I carry, um, a little bit more sophisticated outlet tester that is good for testing, um, outputs from inverters and generators to make sure they’re set up correctly. Um, of course, a camera.
I carry, um, like a nicer quality Canon camera [00:29:00] that’s got a good zoom feature for both up, those up close pictures. And, um, Oh, maybe the most important tool is a, a mirror. So I carry a mirror on a, like a retractable holder. Um, and that’s really helpful. That’s in my hand all day with a flashlight.
And so there I’m looking, of course, in the backsides of things, um, looking on the far side of that keelbolt to see how it’s doing, trying to look around the corner to see what’s going on with the backside of that battery charger, what, you know, whatever it is. Um, so yeah, the mirror is, is a kind of key, key piece of equipment in my tool bag.
Annika: Well, that’s definitely a good selection of tools, and, they are not really things that you would necessarily have on you if you are a boat owner, so definitely need an expert to, to come along. And now something I heard a while ago, um, is that the sort of the survey industry, not that it’s unregulated, but technically anybody could call themselves a surveyor and show [00:30:00] up and, you know, gladly take your money and survey your boat for you.
And I’m wondering, obviously you listed a, a long list of tools and techniques that you use and your survey takes b- a full day. But are there any sort of red flags that people might need to pay attention to in case they are, have not hired, um, a certified surveyor, but they went with a, you know, a brother’s buddy who’s done this a million times before?
Aaron Bandstra: Right. Yeah. Yeah. Good point. Yeah, that does happen., Well, I think kind of the, the check on that is, you know, insurance companies and, and lenders generally will only accept surveys from certain places. And so there’s two main, like professional organizations, NAMS and SAMS. I’m part of NAMS. but both of those are reputable, um, organizations that, that vet their members.
The members are required to keep up on education. We have regular meetings. and just like any [00:31:00] professional organization, it’s a place to, you know, collaborate and share resources and learn together. So I think it’s important that, a potential client,, just check on that to make sure that that surveyor is part of those, one of those two organizations, um- But then, yeah, I guess it– and feel free to, I would encourage people to, you know, call up that surveyor that you’re thinking about hiring and make sure it’s a good fit.
Make sure that that person knows his stuff, um, knows boats, uh, and, get, get a sense of, you know, how, how deep of a inspection am I doing here. Um, maybe ask to see a sample report. That, that’s a common request, and that’s probably the best way to get a sense of, of what to expect from that surveyor.
Uh, sometimes surveyors will publish or have those reports available on their websites. Not always, but so you could look there too, look online, um, or maybe ask for a reference. And so you could ask, ” And often surveyors are recommended by brokers. Brokers will typically [00:32:00] suggest a range or a, a kind of a list of surveyors.
Um, and, you know, while of course they’re representing the seller, naturally they’re, they’re tied in and, and, and have a list of surveyors that they commonly work with. And that– And so you could, uh, maybe ask for a reference, maybe another client that used that same surveyor and ask how their experience was.
yeah. And I would say too, like, you know, might ask too, like if they’re familiar with that certain type of vessel, right? So in the surveying world, some people are more focused on power or sail or commercial boats, and so you might ask about that to make sure that they’re, they’re familiar and comfortable with the kind of boat that you’re, you’re looking at.
Annika: Yeah, definitely. Really good tips here. Now, are the NAMS and SAMS, um, certified, uh, surveyors listed publicly somewhere?
Aaron Bandstra: Yeah. So both of those websites, uh, you can get on either of those websites, NAMS or SAMS, and, and find a surveyor. So you could start there and search for a surveyor in your [00:33:00] region.
Annika: Okay, perfect. I was only thinking of, uh, technically somebody just take a logo and put it on their website. But, you know, if you can cross-reference it, they actually show up on the proper full website, then, you know, just dotting all your Ts and Is and all that. . Now, you mentioned a little bit about the type of boat and making sure that the surveyor is familiar with that.
Is there a big difference– I mean, obviously there is a difference between different, um, construction materials, whether they’re steel or aluminum or, um, fiberglass or wood boats. Are there typically then surveyors who specialize in steel boats or aluminum, or do sort of regular surveyors, um, come across this often enough that they could be, uh, doing these kind of surveys as well?
Aaron Bandstra: Yes, but kind of both. Um, I would say, I mean, certainly ask the surveyor if they’re comfortable. So a lot of times on, on metal boats, aluminum or steel, part of that survey would include, um, a, a metal thickness testing. So whether that surveyor has that, that [00:34:00] equipment, um, an ultrasonic, um, testing machine to test the metal thickness is, is of course worth asking.
so I would say, yeah, not every surveyor would tackle a metal boat or even a wood boat. So wood boats too require some specialized knowledge. Um, it’s more work. There’s more to look at, right? And you’re looking at really every piece of wood that constructs that boat. And so, you know, and so making sure that somebody understands wooden boat construction, and also understands kind of what’s, um, like in, in the wooden boat construction, what, what’s acceptable, right?
It’s not gonna be perfect. Um, so like how, how corroded can those fasteners be? Or, what warrants a frame replacement or a plank replacement or fasten- refastening, and, and what is more of a watch item? So having that kind of nuance, deeper understanding is, is important, um, if you’re gonna hire someone to look at a wooden boat.
and, and metal too, you know, I would [00:35:00] say, uh- You know, with, with steel construction, you know, ultras- the ultrasound thickness testing is part of it, but, you know, visual inspections are a big part too. And really kind of understanding, you know, what warrants attention, what’s a maintenance watch item, what kind of repair to recommend.
Um, there are certain methods for repairing, you know, both wood and metal boats. Um, and so basic- a- and so having a, have a, a deeper understanding is, is important. So I think really kind of interviewing that potential surveyor is the, the best way to start. And maybe asking to see a sample report from another similar boat.
So if you’re looking at a wooden boat, you could be asked to see a, a, a survey report from a, a wooden boat that will give you a sense of that person’s competence.
Annika: And that makes sense ’cause of course you don’t want to be their first, uh, aluminum boat that they’re surveying.
And now then moving slightly off the survey world, but, uh, not really. I’m just thinking for [00:36:00] people who own a boat and they know they’re gonna sell it in a year or two, um, or later, whenever, eventually they will sell it, um, are there some maintenance habits that you would, um, be very happy to see as a surveyor that has been well-maintained?
Aaron Bandstra: Yeah, I mean, a lot of people keep a maintenance log. That’s always reassuring. Um, I, I wouldn’t say that typically as part of a survey we, like, really review that too deeply, but it’s usually pretty apparent, um, if, if the boat has been kept well. You know, those that would be, you know, free of leaks, uh, it’s just dry.
Uh, in, in our climate, keeping a dehumidifier on the boat’s a really good idea to keep it as dry as possible. Evidence of m- engine maintenance, so typically people will, for example, write, you know, the engine hours on an oil filter. Um, that’s reassuring that the engine’s been maintained.
Um, exercising all of the through-hull valves regularly. So sometimes, you know, at least once a year, open and [00:37:00] close each one of the valves, put hands on them, put eyes on them, make sure that they’re looking good, they’re not leaking, and that the valve functions normally. Keeping things tidy and neat, so, you know, lines coiled, uh, that kind of thing is, is helpful.
yeah, and I certainly appreciate a boat where, you know, the, the gear on the boat is just boat maintenance and cruising gear and not, not extraneous so tell- you can just kind of tell right away that this boat is in use, uh, it’s maintained, um, and, and the stuff on board is, is practical and, and not just kind of accumulated, stuff.
Annika: Do you often come across boats that have really not been used in a long time? They’ve been sitting in a boatyard for five years, and you have to start looking at what’s happening there.
Aaron Bandstra: Yeah. Yeah. And it’s true, like, of course, like boats do better when they’re in use, right? Um, so it does happen.
I mean, kind of a common story is, you know, maybe the boat was owned by a member of the family who, you know, was kind of aging out or got, [00:38:00] got sick or their, their life changed in some way where that boat wasn’t used as much anymore. Um, and then it takes maybe a while for the family to kind of realize, “Hey, this isn’t getting used.
Let’s- it’s time to pass on this boat.” And so that’s a common scenario, um, understandable. Or maybe a death, right? Somebody died and it was kind of their boat and the family is ready to pass it on. so yeah, that, that’s pretty common. So I try to be understanding. I mean, of course like not every boat is gonna be in tip-top shape and ready for survey.
Annika: Yeah, for sure. Uh, now as we start to wrap up, I’m curious, do you have any stories of, um, surprising items or things that you have discovered during a survey?
Aaron Bandstra: Well, you know, being, you know, being from here in the Pacific Northwest, I’m used to, you know, like our fiberglass, you know, cruising sailboats and, um, you know, people kind of getting ready to maybe head out on some, some big voyages, and so I, I, I like being around that.
That’s exciting. Um, and hearing about those [00:39:00] plans and thinking about, you know, how to best equip a boat for, for ocean cruising, that, that’s, that’s a neat, neat part of my job is to be around those people and be around that excitement. Uh, but I also appreciate– I’ve done a few s- or a number of surveys for, mostly European boats that end up here in North America, you know, often metal boats, so often steel, um, where people have been cruising for decades and, and cruising in a different way than we’re used to, like very simple.
So I’m thinking right now of a, a boat, a French boat I surveyed, people had- You know, lived on it most of the time for, you know, 20, 30 years, cruised around the world, seen everything. Um, but this boat was so different than what we’re used to here in North America. It was just bare bones. It was so utilitarian.
It was kind of, it was intriguing. That particular boat, for example, had a, a sort of a hand-built autopilot system. The owner, this, this French, sailor was kind of a electrical engineer kind of guy, and, and had, had built [00:40:00] his own, all his own systems. Um, and it was just a fascinating look at how, how other people cruise, uh, in a, in a different way, um, on this kind of bare bones purpose-built machine for sailing.
So that, that was a kind of surprising treat to check that out.
Annika: And, and you bring up a good point ’cause a, a lot of, uh, people must have some creative solutions to whatever problem or improvement that they have created on board. Uh, how do you assess these when they are, you know, not exactly, um, a standard solution, but someone’s made something up?
Aaron Bandstra: I thought you might ask that question. That can be a little tricky, you’re right, ’cause, uh, you know, while you appreciate the, the ingenuity of that person, um, maybe at the same time that hand-built autopilot system isn’t too reliable or, of course, like if anything goes wrong, if, you know, that gets passed on to the next owner, um, that whole boat kind of requires that person, right, to, to run it.
Um, so [00:41:00] yeah, you, you probably wouldn’t have the reliability you would have if you had kind of an off-the-shelf autopilot system where you could just order new parts or order a new component. Um, so yeah, it’s, that’s a little tricky. Um, generally, you know, we have kind of marine standards and, and methods for a reason, so there’s a reason that we use these products and these systems to build or maintain boats, because we’ve kind of arrived at, you know, the best solution we know.
And so when people try to sort of reinvent the wheel, it can… it doesn’t always work that well. Um, sometimes, but not always. So I, I, I try to be, you know, open-minded of course, but really if somebody’s buying that boat, I’ve just gotta be you know, very diligent about just, explaining that like, “While this is not, this is functional, it’s not the marine standard, and it works today, but I don’t think it’s the best long-term solution,”
Annika: Yeah, some diplomatic way of de- describing it.
Aaron Bandstra: Especially if the seller’s [00:42:00] there. Like, and this, this one case I’m thinking of, you know, this really intriguing, interesting French sailor was there, so I, I don’t wanna be like hard on it, you know? He- it had worked for them for decades and so, uh, but the new buyer should know that this is not the norm, um, and you might consider changing it in these ways.
Annika: Yeah, for sure. It’s information that I would want to have if I was looking at, uh, a boat with some, uh, creative solutions for certain things. Now, before we wrap up, is there anything else you wanted to cover, thinking that we have, an audience of potential, boat buyers and, and, and boat owners?
Aaron Bandstra: I guess I would say like I, I feel lucky. It’s a, it’s a pretty interesting line of work. You know, the boats, but mainly the people. I really enjoy being around this community. Lots of interesting people who are, who have plans and have done interesting things.
Um, I haven’t done this, but I’ve thought about it’d be neat to keep a log of all these characters I’ve met, all these people who either have done big voyages [00:43:00] or are planning to. And I keep track of some, of course, some clients sort of become friends and, and stay in touch a bit. Um, but yeah, it’s a, it’s a neat, it’s a neat world that we’re a part of,
Annika: yeah, for sure. I agree. Now, Aaron, thank you very much for your time. I will include all the details on the website so that people can go, uh, go find you and, your services and get in touch in case they have more questions or some need for boat service.
Aaron Bandstra: Sure. Sounds great.