This episode with Julie and Gio from Pelagic Blue explores what long-term liveaboard sailing looks like in practice.
At the time of recording, they were preparing for a Pacific crossing toward the Galapagos, and we talk through the practical side of that process, including planning, permits, fuel logistics, and route decisions.
But more than that, this conversation focuses on how those passages actually feel.
Julie and Gio share how they’ve learned to sail together over time, from navigating different approaches as “two captains” to developing routines that support rest, morale, and good decision-making over weeks at sea.
We also talk about their relationship with their boat, how they approach maintenance and simplicity, and how their idea of home has evolved into something less tied to place and more connected to people.
Transcript:
Annika: I wanted to start today with talking about your upcoming passage. And and I think it’s your biggest passage. Yet. And I know that you are tracing route that John Neal sailed decades ago. and I’m wondering, you know, when you picture crossing, what are you most excited about right now?
Julie & Gio: I don’t know if it’s gonna end up being like our longest passages. Actually, it might be about the same. Maybe a little shorter. We’ll see. ’cause you never really know.
But this, this is the route that John sailed. 1985 to 1986. It’s the 40th anniversary. He left from Washington, uh, same as us. Took off down the coast to the Galapagos, Easter Island across to Picker and then made his way up through the Marquesas in Hawaii. So we’re kind of splitting his first year cruise over several seasons.
But it is, it’s a big one. We’re pretty excited. It is so hard not to get excited about, uh, sailing to the Galapagos. Right? You have to, that’s like a very normal [00:01:00] emotion, but you have to kind of balance that like the passage with the destination and to some extent be okay with the destination changing if the conditions warrant it or something pops up.
So it’s, it’s kind of like a muted excitement for the destination. Like almost hopeful still that it will work out and then excited for the passage. Wow. Uh, my take is so different.
I am beyond excited. To go check out the Revillagigedo Islands. On the way south. So south of Cabo, about 300, 350 nautical miles is the Revillagigedo Archipelago, uh, which features an island called Socorro, and then this little pinnacle called Roca Partita. I’ve been reading about this since I was a kid and super excited to go there. It’s a, it’s a marine sanctuary now, but if you want to go to a place where there are the highest populations of sharks and manta rays mm-hmm. And any pelagic species that you can think of, which we love, right. [00:02:00] Pelagic is our place. It’s awesome. Upwelling, um, out in the middle of the ocean, Uhhuh, uh, that’s the place to do it.
So we’re intentionally taking a, a, a west before we take a south on the way to Galapagos to stop there. so I’m most excited about the fish part of it, whether it’s fishing the whole way we’re going there, or, um, stopping. At and secondly, I’m really stoked about going across the equator. Mm.
It’s a pretty big deal, at least in, in my brain, to, to be going, um, to a different hemisphere. And it is pretty wild that like we’ve sailed tens of thousands of miles. Our, our publisher actually last night was telling us like, you guys, your number hasn’t changed in a couple of years, and we know you’ve been sailing a lot, so you need to redo that math.
And we were like, well, she’s probably right. We’ve sailed many, many thousands of miles now,
the Pacific Northwest and we sailed thousands of miles here every year. So we just haven’t crossed the equator yet. So it’ll be our first time in the [00:03:00] Southern Hemisphere after doing all these other miles.
Annika: And that will be so exciting and I’m sure, and know, different in many ways, a little bit unknown, which you know, all part of the fun adventure. So I really look forward to following your journey on as you get going, um, quite soon actually.
In, in, just in practical terms, what kind of timing are you looking for your, crossings?
How long are they, like how long does it take to sail the Galapagos from Mexico where you are?
Julie & Gio: it depends on the route you want to take. we’re budgeting about 20 to 25 days to get down there. It’s not gonna be a direct shot if you do take the direct shot. Um, you’re, you’re looking at really light winds.
So we’re gonna like, like I said, be heading west before we head south. So we do have to give, uh, Galapagos an ETA ‘ cause of the, the permitting and the check-in process. Mm-hmm. Which we’ll talk about, but. Uh, it should be a three, three and a half week. Um, total passage Yeah, it’s a pretty, pretty [00:04:00] lengthy process preparing to go to the Galapagos and you kind of have to make that decision early on. Um, but they make it really, really easy. You just have to decide but the equator. You can be there anytime of the year and have
Annika: Yeah, that’s really cool. I didn’t realize that it is indeed kind of a year-round destination, isn’t
it? Yeah. So that’s, that’s very handy for, for kinda anytime crossing. Um, so you mentioned you needed to use an agent, and obviously you’ve already been working on this, did you say months? So the red tape must be next level you said. So what I’m gathering is that it’s, it’s doable, but it takes some planning.
Julie & Gio: It does. It definitely takes some planning and some preparation. There’s some specific requirements for work that has to be done to your boat and the documentation of that work, there’s a deposit and then I think it’s 60 days ahead of your planned arrival. Your application has to be filed by your agent.
Annika: [00:05:00] Right. And how long can you stay there in Galapagos then?
Julie & Gio: you can stay up to 60 days. The, the permitting is they actually get you a 60 day permit and you pay for 30 days. And that 60 days is because your arrival time is never going to be precise and your departure time is never gonna be precise.
So they have this, this large window. But if you’re gonna plan to stay beyond that, beyond that 30 days, then uh, there are more fees and, um. And things associated with that. Yeah. And once you get there, you kind of have you kind of to make sure you know how you wanna cruise the islands. And there’s a few ways that people typically do that.
Um, ’cause you can’t backtrack. You arrive in the same port and then you have to file ahead of time your intentions for visiting the other islands. Yeah. We’re really excited to put together a, a presentation on this when we’re done. So it’s actually kind of some, yeah. Very research intensive and, um, documentation intensive. Mm-hmm. [00:06:00] But it’s, um, it’s very doable. There’s a lot of people that are curious about how to go there. And the more we learn there, like it, it’s certainly doable.
Mm-hmm. But it does require a lot of planning. ’cause there’s some places that you can. Receive fuel in mm-hmm. Um, Galapagos. And there’s some ports that you cannot, you only have a select amount of ports and to, to refuel. You can’t just pull up to the fuel dock. You have a panga bringing out a drum of fuel and you have to order how many gallons you want to put in your boat, and they do it for you.
And there are fees associated with it. the word on the street is it’s about $8 a gallon for. Diesel down there, which, um, is Mexico not that alarming where we are in Puerto of Vallarta. That’s what we paid last time we filled up. It is good, right? It it seems kind of stringent and over the top if you’ve been cruising in places where there aren’t a lot of rules or regulations, but it’s such a special destination economically for the country and the islands.
And then ecologically, I mean we were conservation biologist before we took off and went [00:07:00] all of this is like, yes, I’m glad they’re doing this. And it’s been sustainable for protecting those and ecosystems. ’cause it is really, really special. All
Annika: Yeah, absolutely. deserves all the bureaucracy and permits and conservation that So so that’s, that’s really great. How long do you think you’re gonna be in, uh, galapagos?
Julie & Gio: Yeah. I mean for how difficult it is to get to the destination and how much of an investment it’s been for us, um, both temporarily and financially.
Mm-hmm. We’re gonna take advantage of being there for as long as we can. So we’re trying to get 30 days out of it. But you know how that goes. After we leave Galapagos, we’re heading down to Easter Island. We’re, um, always looking at weather windows far in advance. Mm-hmm. We work with a, an awesome weather router, a managed weather service.
Um, and when we start getting toward our 30 day window, we’ll reach out to them and they help us pick the best window for departure. ’cause that’s about, um, another, [00:08:00] another 1800 miles south I believe. Of, of Galapagos.
Annika: So you mentioned you’re looking to sail about 25 days, which is quite a stretch of time still. And I know you’ve done longer passages or long-ish passages before as well, but how are you preparing for this kind of mentally on being out in the ocean just the two of you on a small boat for several weeks?
Julie & Gio: I think that the anticipation is mm-hmm. So exciting. Yeah. Because there are just little gifts that the ocean gives you every day, whether it’s finding a flying fish or two or three or some squid on the bow, or whether you have a new troubleshooting challenge ’cause something stops working.
That’s the exciting part, right? Like, that’s like when you’re training to run a marathon and you finally get to race here, you’re like, oh my God, I get to go. That’s how I feel, at least. Yeah. I feel like a, a kid at a candy store and But yeah, there’s no way to prepare for, for, like I said, expect the unexpected. All, [00:09:00] all of our preparation is, has long been done. Right. We shouldn’t be thinking about the rigging at this point. Shouldn’t be thinking about mm-hmm. The, the health of the engine at this point. so yeah, I’m just excited about the new things that we’re gonna see we haven’t experienced before.
Mm-hmm. Um, we have, um, a new suite of storm sails on board and I, I’m not one of the heavy weather chasers. I’m not excited about, you know, heavy weather, but I am really stoked at the opportunity that we might see some really, um, high wind velocities and get to use some new toys. Not scared of the ocean and have a definitely profound respect for it. But I’m, uh, really excited to, to be in new and different conditions and, and put her to the test.
Annika: I spoke to a solo sailor just, crossed Pacific, on his own, him about 30 days and he said he was so bored because was so uneventful of crossing that he was just bored out of his mind.
Julie & Gio: Which is awesome. Right. Like that’s kind of, it’s interesting ’cause that’s kind of the [00:10:00] goal.
Annika: Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Now we chatted earlier, together with John Neal and Julie, you mentioned something that I wanted to go back to because I didn’t ask it time, and you mentioned something about when you two started, you were two captains, kind of butting heads, but clearly you have figured this out. So can you talk to me more about that? Because that sounded like there’s definitely some interesting stories. behind there.
Julie & Gio: It’s a dynamic Of course. Well, so we did not grow up sailing. We didn’t learn to sail until we were in our, like, early to mid thirties. Um, and we learned together. But prior to that, both of us were working in government positions where we were on power boats all the time.
Both of us operated separately. We worked for different government agencies doing natural resource work, but we were both in charge of driving the boat and training crew on how to do science, do field work and drive boats. And we had different [00:11:00] styles So we had things, processes that worked for ourselves that didn’t necessarily match up with the other person, which makes perfect sense.
We had completely different jobs and completely different people. we realized that we had different, uh, not different risk mitigation. We’re both very conservative when it comes to risk but, different ways.
Different ways of kind of like getting being on watch, different ways the boat to bed it’s the end of the day kind of thing. So we, we did kind of have to be like, Hey, that’s not how it’s done. Oh wait, you do it too, but you do it different. Whose way are we going to do?
’cause there can, you can definitely co-captain and co-captain is ideal, but co-captains have to kind of sort of share the same brain. You have to have agreement on how certain things are gonna unfold. yeah. And I will. Second that we definitely do not think the same way about things, but we, the end goal is always the same.
Let’s keep this as safe as [00:12:00] possible. So when we take the emotion out of it, which sometimes has to be like a, Hey, let’s, let’s take a step back and look at the situation mm-hmm. Holistically and, and what are we trying to accomplish together. that’s usually when, when we make progress, but when we’re trying to, um, accomplish the same thing differently.
Mm-hmm. That’s when we, when we butt heads. But we’ve been, um, we’ve been doing this together for a while now. Long time. Yeah. Um, and we still again, have the same goal and it’s to get us there safely and happily and make sure that Sea Fox is, um, is well taken care of as possible along the way.
Annika: Yeah, exactly. Okay. Well I’m glad to hear that story and how that has unfolded in a, in a positive way. Now I wanted to go back to a little bit on sort of longer passages, because in many ways they’re kind of, Um, of a chain of small decisions that you have to keep making over a few weeks. And of course eventually you get tired because you’ve been [00:13:00] sailing for three weeks, maybe four weeks.
And i’m just wondering, do you have a system? Like how do you make good decisions when you’re tired and you are worn down and you know, there’s still many days or weeks to go?
Julie & Gio: well so it’s an question ’cause I would say that on most of our long passages so far, we’re definitely ready for a break from the watch schedule by the end. But unless the conditions have been. Truly challenging. We feel good at the end of a passage. And that’s kind of the goal, right?
You wanna arrive well rested, when you’ve been offshore for weeks at a time and suddenly there’s land. You definitely get a little extra excited. we, we tend to feel pretty darn good. I think the first few days are where most people struggle. Um, and having a good understanding with your crew or your partner is plays a role.
If. We will tend to be a little more on the conservative side if we’re not feeling as great or if we’re tired. So Yeah. I [00:14:00] think it’s really interesting. when, when I talk to other people that sail as a couple, I’m always very interested in looking at their watch schedule and seeing how they divide up their time. We’ve developed a watch schedule that works really well for us. Mm-hmm. Um, we’re three on three off and there is, um, there’s no room for debate, but when we’re, when we’re out there, we’re really taking care of each other.
Like it is my goal to make sure that, We’re in the condition to make good decisions. So good decisions come from fatigue and dehydration or bad decisions? We’re always, Sorry. We’re always, um, I’m always looking out to make sure that Julie’s drank enough water, that she’s had her electrolytes for the day.
Mm-hmm. and during the day you’re excited to, um, to be awake and be part of, you know, whatever’s happening around you. But, you know, off watch when you’re only sleeping or, or on and off on watch three hours off, watch [00:15:00] three hours. It’s really important to make sure that you get adequate rest. And we get into a cycle where, you know, you just know, um, your body and when it’s time for you to go to bed.
So we don’t, I don’t think that we end up in really rough shape when we’re, um, offshore. Mm-hmm. Now terrible weather conditions change that. Yeah, a bit. And you don’t get to choose when that happens. Um, but I think we’ve developed a system that works really well for. Um, our sailing style and we’re very good about looking after the other, our, our co-captain and making sure that they’re taking care of themselves.
Mm-hmm. Yeah, it’s really interesting that that’s kind of both of our default is to keep an eye on the other person, which works well for a lot of people. They kind of turn inward Um, and it’s interesting that that’s our, that’s our default is I take care of you, you take care of me. The boat takes care of both of us. We take care of the boat like it’s good. And Julie’s also like fabulously talented in the galley and like with [00:16:00] galley management, um, and nutrition and just food in general is a big part of, of morale.
And to have a salad week three of a passage. It’s a uplifting for the soul. Right. And she’s really good about making sure that there are little things taken very good care of and stashed away. So there are, prizes the whole time coming outta the galley. It’s true. I, um, I think that was a, a little tidbit from John way back in the day And then after our fist passage together, we had figured it out. So now it is kind of like a, a priority to make sure there’s goodies. So we both, we we’re both in charge of each other’s treats for the most part, whatever our vices are.
Um, so that they don’t all go away in one shot. If it’s dark chocolate, I’ll eat it till it’s gone, of course. But it’s nice when I come up for my watch and there’s a couple little squares waiting on the dashboard for me. Really lovely for sure. So we, we kind of like help each other [00:17:00] out with our I’ll make sure that there’s some of Gio’s favorite things and then just some special sauces or goodies, like somewhere in the back of all the cabinets.
I forget where they are. I don’t inventory them ’cause I want them to be a surprise. So there’s always some little goodie
somewhere in the cabinet that you’re gonna find later on. And it’s usually when you need a little, pick me up.
Annika: oh, that sounds really sweet. And it’s such a good principle, like, you know, you take care of other and then, you know, the boat takes care of you and you take care of the boat together. It’s uh, it’s a nice little circle there., It sounds like, you know, there is a certain routine to passage making, but these little things that you just described are these little surprises that make I guess a little bit exciting and there’s little regular, nice little surprises along the way.
Mm-hmm.
Julie & Gio: Yeah. Yeah, absolutely it is.
So, um, recently read, reread the book South by Ernest Shackleton, the captain on the Endurance. Right. Super famous story. Um, there’s tons of books about it, but his [00:18:00] account, if you read through like his journals, the more dire the situation gets for those guys who are like stuck on the ice and not really sure when they go, when they’re gonna leave, the more focused his energy becomes on keeping them fed, but when they only have penguins and seals and a little bit of powdered milk.
How are you gonna not serve them the same every day? ’cause he recognized how critically important that was to the safety, of the crew. And it is, it is totally true
Annika: Yeah, absolutely. And I’ve not read the book, but I actually listened to a really good podcast series on Shackleton and the whole, well, all of his expeditions and yeah. And in one of the cases, I they went on smaller
expedition he
had hit like,
what was it, plum pudding or, or something that he pulled out
at
Julie & Gio: Christmas or at some special occasion.
And it
just like,
Annika: it was, you know, after weeks of eating,
Julie & Gio: just like,
Annika: small rations
of nothing. Very
Julie & Gio: exciting.
of penguin feet. Penguin feet and seal bacon.
Oh yeah. Basically
Annika: [00:19:00] if even that, and it was such a uplifting moment for them to have like, like you said, it
definitely
helps
with the the mental
health part of
it,
Julie & Gio: Totally. Totally. More than people realize, I think.
Annika: Now, um, I’ve been thinking a lot about, the concept of home recently, and I’ve talked to some other
guests
about this
as well.
And, uh, I am curious to hear your thoughts on this because I think your home is kind of tied to your boat and if I remember correctly, you don’t own a house on land how do you define home for you these days?
Julie & Gio: That’s a really great question. Such a good question. Yeah. We do not own a home on land. That’s very true. Um, our business is based out of Anacortes, and Anacortes is where we went to retrain as marine technicians. But not only do we train as marine technicians, we established our, our whole support network there.
Mm-hmm. So really when I’m on C Fox with Julie, that’s our home. We’re [00:20:00] turtles. Yeah. But, um, it was so great. We, we put the boat in Puerto Deto and we flew up here for the Seattle Boat Show and we had such an awesome, warm welcome from our friends here. Um, a good friend of ours, Lynette, um, opened up her home, invited a whole bunch of guests over and made a fantastic meal.
Mm-hmm. And had us over and the whole gang was there and they were all welcoming and excited and we got to have a talk with, uh, Mike Beamer, who just finished the, um, the Northwest Passage and catch up with everybody and talk about their new life and sailing adventures. so it is nice to have our. home base away from home, even though there’s not, uh, a physical residence there.
We are always welcome and we always have a place to stay and people that are excited to see us when we go up there and we have a storage unit there, so we like go say hi to our stuff every once in a while, yeah, it is interesting ’cause because what’s left of it really. But cruising full time is tough on people [00:21:00] and on boats and if you’re, if your cruise is gonna be, a sabbatical of sorts, so you know, you’ve got a year or two years or three years.
Two to three years is about the max that most people are happy to be living aboard full-time. They don’t feel the need to take a break. Um, we call C Fox our home for anywhere between five and nine months out of the year. And then we take breaks so that C Fox gets a break and then we kind of get to visit other too.
And I, I think our home becomes more defined by the relationships and the connectivity than it does physical location. Um, especially you learn that when you’re cruising ’cause you’re just bringing your home with you wherever you go. And if you speak a bit of the language and you’re comfortable poking around, like anything can just feel like a different version of a physical home.
But the boat is your home But then that, that home on, on land is definitely different for us. That it’s more people based.
Annika: Yeah, thanks for sharing that. It’s always interesting to hear different people’s, uh, [00:22:00] thoughts, especially after they’ve been living this kind of, uh, lifestyle for an extended period of time. So it’s always
interesting to hear these stories. And now I’d love to hear more about you both, and I am sure we’ve talked about it in some of our earlier interviews way back
when, but,
we haven’t talked about your boat
Uh, in a little while in detail, and I’m just curious, it is a Malo
39,
Julie & Gio: Right? Yep.
Very correctly. Excellent.
Annika: what makes that specific boat good for passengers, uh, for
Julie & Gio: you? Because that’s the one that we own. No, that’s, that’s not true. But we would, we would make good with, with any floating platform we put underneath us. Totally. We are, super fortunate to have had John’s, gracious and very informed help when we were boat shopping. Mm-hmm. We would’ve ended up on a very different hull had it not been for, uh, John, you know, leading us in a different direction saying, Hey, have you thought about this? Have you considered, uh, you know, [00:23:00] what are your priorities in owning this boat? And, one of ’em was the lowest cost of ownership.
And that really, makes a lot more sense now that we’ve owned the boat. Uh, comes down to getting something that’s really well made and as new as you can possibly buy, everything on your boat is gonna eventually need to be replaced. And if the manufacturer, uh, when they were putting the boat together did cut corners or used not good materials, um, that’s gonna make your, your sail.
It doesn’t matter if it’s coastal crews or going offshore, a lot more difficult because you’re gonna have system issues. You’re gonna have, uh, infrastructure issues. The more things that I take apart on C Fox, and I’ve taken apart almost all of them at this point. Yeah. Um, more I find out that the manufacturer did the best job that they possibly could, the best materials that they had available to them.
C Fox is simple rig, just a sloop rig, so we don’t have to deal with any extra stays. the [00:24:00] Tankage is very sufficient for water. We have 150 gallons of water available on board. Um, we keep one of the tanks full as a reserve tank, and the other one is just our, our tank that we use. So we all have that redundancy there.
Um, we have 74 gallons of fuel on board, and then we keep a couple cherry jugs and a lazarre. So our effective range is about six to 700 nautical miles. And she has a very good motion on the sea, doesn’t have these long overhangs. Um, it’s a lead ballasted encapsulated keel. Um, so that lead being a higher density, it makes her a stiffer boat.
The fact that it’s an encapsulated ballast, means that we’re not gonna have any trouble with keel bolts rotting, although that takes salt water being in the bilge and we are fanatical about a dry and clean bilge. we just were fortunate to have good coaching, um, before we knew how great of a boat it is.
But then having, uh, gone through the whole thing, we [00:25:00] couldn’t ask for, uh, a better built vessel. Yeah, I think I like beyond the purchasing, like selecting the right boat, which John, John is totally the expert. He he gets to know you and then kind of has this Special magic eight ball where he kind of knows where you’re, where you’re trying to get before you do in your cruising life everything on the boat.
I’m like a foot shorter than geo. Everything that he can do, I can do myself as well. And when you’re cruising as a couple, you are functionally single handing, which a lot of people don’t think about But when it’s the two of you and one person’s sleeping and they need that rest, you are definitely single handing that it’s important to be able to do everything And if the boat is difficult for one person or multiple people to be able to do all those things, kinda wears away at your confidence And it’s always okay to wake the other person up for help. But if it’s something small or something minor that you feel like you should be able to do yourself or you do it frequently during a watch, it’s nice [00:26:00] to know that you can do it yourself.
So. We’ve worked really hard to make sure that that is the case on C Fox. And as we change and modify her systems, um, that kind of evolves with it. We’re also kind of, we’re the weird people at the dock who are always taking things off our boat. We’ve, we’ve are constantly, like at least twice a year, we are critically looking at the boat and being like, is there anything that we haven’t touched in a while?
Is there any system that we don’t use or a line that doesn’t make sense to us, or a turning block that we could alleviate here to reduce friction in some way or just constantly reevaluating what’s there. So it’s very not quite minimalistic. but we feel very comfortable, So it’s the right boat for us and our style, and it continues to evolve as our style evolves. Yeah, and the established relationship that we have with C Fox, it’s not a new relationship. We’re not, you know, anything goes wrong [00:27:00] underway. Uh, we’re not gonna be discovering a new system or something we haven’t seen before.
Uh, we’re absolutely, adamant about having touched all of the things we possibly can before leaving land. So there’s no surprises, no systems that, um, they haven’t at least been checked over with a critical eye before taking off that they’re gonna be a surprise. It’s true. This past winter we dropped the mast And all of our friends were like, didn’t you just do that like a couple of years ago? And we were like, well, yeah, but we sail a lot and Those are things that some people will never do during their ownership of a boat. Um, So we’re, we’re kind of in anomaly and that we’re constantly reevaluating and rechecking how do we make it make it better? How do we make it stronger? Mm-hmm. How do we make C fox bulletproof? Yeah.
Annika: Yeah, always fine tuning and optimizing
everything.
thanks for sharing all that. Those were really good tips and I took a lot of mental notes there. And going back to what you said about, sort of the age of the [00:28:00] boat and maybe leading towards newer than not, I completely agree with that because, um, last year we were looking
at, um,
a
boat
and
we
were you know, looking at multiple boats, but one of them was an ML from the eighties
and
it was a
lovely boat and, you know, it’s 47 feet long.
I think it
would’ve
been
also a very interesting boat to have. But, and now I’ve forgotten what part it was, but there was something that’s like, oh yeah, if that goes,
you’re outta luck. Because they don’t make
Julie & Gio: that part anymore.
Annika: even though a male is
Julie & Gio: on that one? Was it like the port lights were gonna
have to be custom built or something?
Annika: Yes, it might have been something like
Julie & Gio: that.
Annika: No, no, actually, no. This is something else. This was the geno that had the big windows that those would’ve
had
to be custom made
Julie & Gio: as well. Mm-hmm.
Annika: You’re right. That was
another thing,
and this actually was a newer boat. It was 2007 Geno ano, like the Dexon version, and those curved [00:29:00] windows that go
Julie & Gio: Mm-hmm.
Annika: make the boat beautifully light
and just
gorgeous.
Um, yeah, the factory does not make them anymore, even though it’s totally still a functioning factory. They just don’t make them. So you have to have them custom made,
Julie & Gio: which
is
Annika: potentially
a little
Julie & Gio: risky.
Yeah. And that’s what you
Annika: that’s an
interesting point. Yeah, That that wasn’t a newer
Julie & Gio: even even on C Fox, for example, we have, gosh, so many cabinets. They did such a good job with the wood joinery inside.
but on, on sheet metal where it’s pressed, where you have a tight radius is where you have the, the weakest point. So on the cabinet hinges where those bend, they’re just starting to break and it’s just an age related issue. And we’re lucky enough that the company that manufactured ’em, Roka still makes them.
But in order to get these parts, I had to have my aunt in Italy order the parts, get them to her house in Florence, and then she had to hand carry them to, uh, California and then put ’em in a mailbox and send ’em to us. But I could [00:30:00] imagine if you had a, an older. Say, American built a boat from back in the day.
And, you know, America, when we were building things in the seventies was making some really awesome boats. But I’ll guarantee that the factories that were putting those hinges together, uh, aren’t around anymore. And those are just little things that you don’t think about. But what if you’re getting an older boat and, and all your, your cabinet hinges are failing, or all the knobs, uh, you’re gonna have to completely reinvent that system and it’s gonna have to all be custom to fit the existing hole that’s there.
And, um, gosh, that could take you such a long time. So I just ordered, I mean, a, a 30 pack of these hinges. We have enough hinges until C Fox goes to the next owner and hopefully we can hand them a handful of these. Then we had. You know, the cabinet handles to open all of ’em from Nigel. Yeah. Yeah. Those are near impossible to find.
We had to work with Jan an Stan who does, uh, the boat how to, him and Nigel. Um, Nigel owned 45 foot Malo. Um, and had a [00:31:00] whole cabinet full of these handles. So we had to have Nigel Hand deliver us a bunch of these cabinet handles. ‘ cause you, you cannot even find them anymore. I think there was something funny about when he bought them too.
’cause he needed them for his boat. And we were talking to him about this a couple years ago at the boat. Jokes we’re like, Nigel, where did you find these crazy parts that were having such a hard time finding? And the, the knobs. The latches. He was like, well, they didn’t make ’em anymore. So I had to order like 300 of ’em.
So if you need more, I still have lots. It was pretty funny. He gave us a few and then we had a few more fail and then. A few weeks later, we had this like, strange package that we didn’t recognize that the mail show up. We were like, what is this? I didn’t order it. Did you? And it was this like cornucopia of our door latches, cabinet latches from Nigel calls.
We were like, oh, it really does take a village.
Annika: Exactly. Oh, that’s perfect. They’re like a little black market where these, uh, very [00:32:00] particular
Julie & Gio: Yeah. Yeah.
Annika: Oh
Julie & Gio: It’s part of the fun if you let it be that, but it, it, it’ll drive you crazy if you get frustrated
with it. But it’s just kind of part of the deal.
Annika: that’s true, that’s true. And of course that is, yes, a functional part, but not a critical thing if it’s a door handle. But it could have been something, especially in an older boat, it could have been something
that is very critical and you can’t just get it from the manufacturer anymore, and maybe you’re cruising somewhere in the Caribbean or in the Pacific where
Julie & Gio: it takes, Yeah. you
Annika: weeks to ship anything from anywhere.
So, uh, it takes a lot of, uh, thinking when you start digging into these little things. And it’s always interesting to hear these conundrums and how people solve them.
Julie & Gio: Yeah. Well, and, and it makes, you know, the more experience you get with it, the more critical of an i you get when you’re looking at other boats.
Um, and you know, like you said with the, Jeanneau and the windows, I remember looking at those boats and being like, yeah, that’s a beautiful deck salon, but if you ever have to reed those port lights, you’re gonna be cutting the boat [00:33:00] apart. Mm-hmm. so yeah, more experience makes you a little, um, more, more weary when you’re, when you’re analyzing boats about, um, you know, the, the future serviceability and the potential to service something that is fully custom.
I think it speaks to a lot to the concept of having a starter boat before buying your actual like blue water boat or cruising boat. Just having some little trailer sailor, that’s what we did with a little 18 foot boat, um, that we sailed like crazy and fixed everything. And it kind of on a lower, less intense, less critical scale you to doing the projects, finding the parts, thinking about the systems, and it’s fun.
Right? and the stuff you need is at Home Depot or West Marine, so you’re not having to, to really like go to the next tier of complexity. Plus you get to sail it, you put something new in and then you go sail it. And that builds your skills too, right?
When the whole starter boat is, what was it, 3,500 bucks? I think we paid for that boat. And you don’t feel like you have to bend over backwards to make [00:34:00] your chain plates out of, A four stainless steel.
Annika: Absolutely. And what I learned in the last year is like going to see different boats is so
educational. Cause we were looking at quite like, you know, newer boats, older boats, and a little bit everything in just to see, because there were so many great boats, for sale in where we lived in France. It was really easy to go see all these great boats and, uh, it was such an educational experience, especially when adding your guys’ commentary and John’s commentary was like, wow, we are seeing things in a whole different light now.
Julie & Gio: Yeah. And that’s often something that we’ll do with our sail training expedition students too. We’ll kind of give a chance to walk the docks before we go out give them the skills, give them the experience, hang out, live on the boat for a while, and then come back to the dock and do a dock walk.
And people look at boas really differently after that experience. You have a more critical eye. You have things that you now know you like or you don’t like, or something that doesn’t quite work for you. And it’s [00:35:00] really interesting just in that short amount of time with some education, how different your perspective can become.
Annika: Now, if we shift gears a little bit, uh, forward, and you know, you have this big Pacific crossing coming up and you are gonna be exploring new areas, which is, uh, very
exciting.
Um,
but I’m thinking beyond the Pacific. Uh, what are you sort of curious about
Julie & Gio: right
now
Annika: when you’re thinking about what’s coming and what’s, uh, what’s
Julie & Gio: in
store
for you?
We teach a curriculum that was built by John Neal from the ground up over 50 years of experience. Mm-hmm. 50 years of experience is something that can only be earned, right. Um, we don’t wanna be out there advising people and teaching people without still learning ourselves. Every experience that we have, we learn more.
So the South Pacific I think is almost a rite of passage for anyone that plans to be a voyager, um, [00:36:00] and the Pacific or the Atlantic, I guess. Yeah. But I think that, um, you know, going over to the. Caribbean or going over to the Mediterranean, uh, will be a good, good experience in that. Um, we will have more hands-on experience and we’ll be able to better advise people on, um, how to, to obtain or reach their goals.
getting on different boats is something I’m really excited about. We are aligning ourselves to get on as many boats as possible. C Fox is amazing. She’s not the forever boat. We have to go explore new ones. Don’t tell her that right Please, as far as she knows, we, she’s the one. and you know, and who knows, who knows how that’ll play out.
We do have a lot of confidence in that boat. And it, you know, to go from a boat that you’ve touched every system and made everything as perfect as it can be, and bulletproof as it could be to get on something that you now have to reestablish a relationship, that’s a tough pill to swallow. [00:37:00] but yeah, we we’re gonna keep.
Going out and keep sailing and keep getting on new boats and keep going to new parts of the world. so we have, you know, firsthand experience, experiential knowledge that we can share that’s relevant.
curious about where we’re actually gonna end up. ’cause I think in the beginning we have this like grand plan of we’re gonna go to all these countries in this amount of time and then we realize, I mean, it’s a cruising thing, right? You’re always balancing the time, the weather and the budget.
And, and now we’ve learned to be more flexible and keep things more open-ended and Like, we’ve got this season all set and then we’ll see what.
La Nino brings, or El Nino brings in the next season and have our plan A through F and we’ll be excited about every single one of those plans plus the combinations of those plans if that’s what we end up having to do. And who knows.
Annika: And that’s such a good mindset because imagine you have a really strict plan. You have your top 10 destinations that you have to go, or otherwise, it’s a whole trip. It’s a
Julie & Gio: failure.
Yeah.
Annika: So
Julie & Gio: [00:38:00] Yeah. That’s very well said. We, um, we learned the, the tough way to keep it open-ended and it really is about the, um, the journey, not the destination. Mm-hmm. So we’re embracing that as, as much as possible. And yeah, you never know what you’re gonna come across if you leave it open-ended and not, it doesn’t, can’t be loosely planned ’cause of weather and maintenance mandates, but, keep it kind of loose and resist the urge to compare.
It’s so easy these days to compare your crews to someone else’s oh, they did this route and I need to do that exact route. And man, if, if you’re fo so focused on that, you kind of like lose sight of all the wonderful things that are happening around you that you have worked so hard to get to.
So
Yeah,
for sure.
Annika: So you have a lot of cool things coming up, sailing your own boat, but what about on your business side, because you’re still running that too. I know there are
Julie & Gio: sail training expeditions coming
every summer
Annika: and
Julie & Gio: all sorts of consultations
Annika: and stuff. So [00:39:00] what’s happening with your, with your business?
That must
be a lot
of
exciting stuff that keeps you, uh,
Julie & Gio: as well.
It is so fun. For sure. We are, um, this summer we have decided, and this was by request. But from multiple people to go around Vancouver Island, uh, and lead a flotilla. And it’s really exciting for a bunch of reasons.
First is because it’s one of our favorite places. It’s amazing. fishing is incredible. But the, these glacial fjords that you are just, I mean, it’s, it’s awe striking, uh, the inside and the outside. So we get to the privilege of leading a flotilla going around the island.
Mm-hmm. Um, and we’re gonna be using the charter model for that. We’re going through, um, San Juan sailing and chartering. Is it a Bavaria 34. Uh, not anything that I would ever or have the opportunity to get on without, um, having put this floatilla together.
So I’m really excited to just look at. different systems and try different boats and see how different manufacturers are putting things together. But then also to be able to [00:40:00] share our favorite place firsthand with people on their own boat that are excited to go around because it’s different, when you have your own boat, the kind of training that you’re going to want, as opposed to, uh, someone that’s really green, that doesn’t have a boat yet, so that’ll be really fun. Um, developing that camaraderie. Camaraderie and taking a new boat for a lap. then we’ll pick up with sail training expeditions in the Pacific Northwest this summer. Our favorite place of course, um, for training ’cause it’s challenging.
There’s light wind, there’s heavy weather, there’s big swell. There’s. All kinds of tides and currents and passes to navigate. And it’s we’re pretty stoked. We have some great crews signed up for the summer that we’re excited to help. They have awesome cruising goals and they’re just wonderful people that we can’t wait to sail with. So it works well. So this will be a different, different summer for us, but I we will end up getting to sail probably four different boats with crews and we sort of.
Get to kind of pick the boat that matches the goals [00:41:00] of the crew now, which is very cool. It’s not always the same boat with just one setup that we think is like the end all, be all or not potentially. Um, there’s different cruising goals and different boats that match those goals and it’s really nice that we can pick a boat that we think best matches the goals of
Annika: Yeah, that sounds like so much fun, and I love that, okay, you’re gonna sail your boat to the Pacific and you’re gonna leave your boat and leave your land life for
a while when you’re actually just out there cruising other people’s boats. Yeah. It’s not a bad lifestyle. Not at all.
Julie & Gio: No, it definitely takes effort and quite a bit of juggling, but but it’s really exciting and we’re.
Super lucky to be able to do it we’re, I think our teaching schedule is busier than ever this year actually too. We, we’ve been teaching classes online and in person and at the Marine Tech Center for several years now and they just keep getting better and better ’cause we’re getting more experience and we’re constantly refining [00:42:00] and now we’re starting to see our students from those classes when we were first teaching them out in crazy places.
We’re like seeing boats on a IS that were like, Hey, they were in our class. Hey they came and sailed with us and it is so cool. That is truly what keeps us going is when we’re, we were in the market in La Cruz a couple weekends ago in Mexico and we were like, I think we know those. People and they recognize us and we’re like, oh my gosh, this is so crazy.
We haven’t seen each other in months, thousands of miles away. We’re in the same place. They’re having a blast. They’re using the skills that we taught them, and they’re benefiting from that investment in their education and preparation. And it is, it is just so cool to end up on the dock with your students who are, they’ve done it, they’ve done it, they took off, and That is the gratifying part, is seeing students out there. Mm-hmm. So it’s, um, send a shout out to Eric and Julie on Ocean Love. Mm-hmm. They’re, they’re awesome. [00:43:00] They came to our, uh, weekend electrical and Anor. And Eric was so stoked. He’s like, I cannot thank you guys enough. He’s like, we had a brand new water maker put on board before we took off.
The whole thing is under warranty. We’re halfway down through Mexico and the pump just quit. He’s like, I would not have even known where to start troubleshooting had it not been for taking your class. He’s like, but I got on the phone with their, um, warranty technician. I was using my, DVLM, my multimeter to, to take readings on the equipment and I was able to report to, to the guy on the other end of the phone exactly what was happening.
Mm-hmm. Troubleshoot the problem and pinpoint it right away. And they actually have already received their replacement, electrical motor and they’re back underway with the water maker working. Mm-hmm. But that is, uh, really the gratifying part, Seeing students out there succeeding.
And that’s only a two day class, that’s a weekend class that we put together from our professional training. And we’re like, if, if it was us and we didn’t have nine months [00:44:00] to go back to school and a boat to work on like this, like what would be the most important things that we could take from our training and cramm those into a weekend?
And, and we don’t really know until we get that feedback if it worked for people who aren’t in the trades. And it’s so cool to be like, oh, it worked. It’s perfect. The curriculum worked, they learned and they’re having so much fun.
Annika: Exactly, and you’re, you know, making their cruising easier, which
absolutely great.
And
I mean,
mean it sounds like it’s such a rewarding
Julie & Gio: career that
you have ’cause you get this
Annika: feedback
every
Julie & Gio: often
Annika: from your students or you them out
Julie & Gio: cruising
and
it
must
be
just
so
great.
Oh, it’s just incredible. It’s, I don’t think we, we were prepared for how rewarding that would feel to like, we turn into an anchorage and.
See a boat, see three boats actually that we recognize and we’re like, oh my gosh, we haven’t seen them or heard from them in a couple of years and they did it. They’re here. just
indescribable.
Annika: So now you will of course, continue to do teaching [00:45:00] as we’re recording this. You are doing it at the Seattle Boat Show, and I assume an Apple boat show will follow in the
fall
again.
And
people can learn more about everything that you do on your website and on
your
socials.
Is there anywhere else you would want them to direct or anything specific, uh,
resource
wise,
Julie & Gio: we keep our website pretty up to date. I would say that, uh, we’re having a lot of fun and we’re not updating our socials quite as often. It gets a little challenging the, in other countries. Yeah. Yeah. We, we tried to kinda like. Keep it real and keep it a little, a little less like real timey on our social.
So our website usually has the most up to date information, But you can always drop us an email if you’re curious about something too. But Yep. Website, and you can check cruisers college.org. Mm-hmm. That has the, the courses that we’ll be doing at the Marine Technical Center in Anacortes.
we have our, our full weekend hands-on, um, offshore cruising seminar coming up in November, along with our full weekend [00:46:00] hands-on, um, electrical course. Yeah.
Annika: that’s perfect. Yeah, your website
Julie & Gio: is
a great place
to
Annika: get
lost in
Julie & Gio: rising also cool stuff there Yeah, I think we have a, we have a few spots left for sail training expeditions this summer too. That’s all up to date on our website, but
Annika: Well, Julie and gi, it’s been amazing to catch up with you again, and I wish you the best
of luck,
uh, with the boater that’s happening right now, but also for your
Julie & Gio: uh, Pacific Adventures,
Annika: and I can’t
wait to
see what Galapagos and
the rest
of it looks like for you. I.
Julie & Gio: Oh, Annika, thank you so much as always for having us. You have such wonderful and insightful questions. Mm-hmm. Um, you are a true asset to the cruising It’s true. I think your, your humility really shows through in these interviews, and it’s so wonderful to listen to the questions that you ask the honest responses that you get from whoever you interview.
It’s, I think that you’re reading everyone’s mind. You’ve got your own Magic eight ball for aspiring cruisers, so thank you for [00:47:00] sharing that with everyone.
It’s helpful for all of us.
Annika: Aw. Thank you.
Julie & Gio: You guys are
Annika: are too nice. that’s
Julie & Gio: really
nice to hear.
it. Thank
you.